Retic noise and leak

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Retic noise and leak

Postby gonetopilbara » Thu Oct 27, 2016 11:16 am

Hi,

I have some issue with my retic. It is set-up in the following manner.

- Double adapter from outside tap (seen in 1st video link)
- 25mm PVC pipe to master isolation valve (seen in 2nd video link)
- distribution pipe for want of a better word
- 2 x 19mm solenoids (when these are running it is when noise occurs)
- 1 x 25mm solenoid - currently not connected to anything (leaks no matter what I do)

I have included links to some videos as this will explain the issues much better. Also uploaded as attachments.

1. Noise when retic is running.
13.7mb video
https://mega.nz/#!LoEGmKKB!yMWUIxtEROxXOO8lUV3ob3TnZk5Apfs6X7TKmJ86X1A

I think this is caused by air, which goes away if I open tap completely on 25mm solenoid and then open and close the "air purge screw",
but it comes back soon after.

2. Leak from 25mm solenoid
11.1mb video
https://mega.nz/#!ywllyCSY!oPnLY1S-WCfzi9Tt7f2LGzKoSHlaBHMW1fAm8CqRCwI

I don't understand why this is leaking. It is hooked up, but not programmed to work as there is nothing yet connected to it. It doesn't seem to matter
if I open or close the "tap" at the top, it still continues to slowly drip.

Have I made a beginners mistake and left something out of the system or done something wrong?

Bill
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby abwal » Fri Oct 28, 2016 11:48 am

I would guess that the noise is not caused by air, but is more likely to be vibration of the valve. The fact that it is not present when the valve is fully open tends to indicate this. Have you tried adjusting the pressure at the tap so water entering the solenoid is not at too great a pressure? I found it better to adjust the water flow at the tap and to have the solenoid valve at least half open.

Did you use thread sealing tape for all connections to avoid leakage?
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby gonetopilbara » Sun Oct 30, 2016 10:15 am

Hi,

Tried the main tap from the house at all different openings and this made no difference.

With the 25mm solenoid, which is the last inline, something just occurred to me, when you said to 1/2 open the tap. When I open the tap any amount
or even close it I still get a drip from the "outgo" side. Shouldn't this solenoid be shut as it is hooked up and not programmed to come on? If yes, why
would this be operating in this manner? It is brand new, so if I have this correct, it seems like it is always open even when it should be closed, so what
would cause this to happen. I could have made a mistake.

Yes thread tape has been used on all joints.

The 25mm solenoid is leaking (slow drip) from the "outgo" side where it connects to the poly-pipe (currently no poly pipe connected)

Same noise and same leak.

The only two things that stop the noise when it is operating are
- open the 2nd tap on the tap double adapter (no good as water just pours on ground)
- opening the screw on top of the 25mm solenoid tap which I assume is for purging the valve (this is no good as it just pours out the "outgo" side)

Any other suggestions as noise is unbearable.
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby abwal » Sun Oct 30, 2016 6:28 pm

It could be a faulty solenoid in that the valve is sticking. This would cause the drip when it is- supposedly- closed. If that valve is mis-functioning, it would vibrate under pressure causing the noise.

Did you try adjusting the flow on the solenoid while the water is flowing through it? I had noise in one at one stage and, from memory, this is how I found a position where the valve did not vibrate. Try closing it firmly and then opening fully. Repeat this a few times.

If this fails to work, I would talk to the supplier of the solenoid. If you bought it at a hardware store then talk to someone at either a nursery or an irrigation supplier instead. Many hardware store employees are not always reliable for information.
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby abwal » Sun Oct 30, 2016 6:41 pm

I just had a look at your video. It seems to be the same solenoid as the one I had.
Does the leak continue for a while or could it be just the water on the outside of the valve draining out? Unfortunately it was not possible to tell from the video.
That is a fairly substantial drip. I still feel that you are right to suspect that the valve is not closing fully. Tightening and releasing it may free it up. You should be able to hear the valve operating when the power is turned on. Turn your water supply tap off so the vibration does not occur or it may drown out the sound of the valve operating.
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby gonetopilbara » Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:10 pm

I have now isolated the issue, but still don't fully understand what is causing the "noise/vibration".

I have removed the leaking 19mm pipe solenoid and replaced it with a 25mm blank with threadtape.
(I know I said 25mm, but that is the size of the threaded connection off the pipe "in go side)


I now have 2 13mm pipe solenoids.

1st on the extension runs to 10 drippers (there is noise/vibration when this station is on)

2nd on the extension runs to 5 drippers (there is no noise/vibration when this station is on)

Any ideas?
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby abwal » Tue Nov 01, 2016 4:40 pm

You could open the solenoid and check that everything is seated correctly. A small piece of grit ( or anything else) under the edge of the valve will prevent it from functioning correctly. This is not a difficult job, but could well void any warranty.
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby gonetopilbara » Wed Nov 02, 2016 12:55 pm

Fixed :)

Well I think it is. Time will tell.

The 1st "13 mm solenoid" must have had something either in it or not seated correctly.

I removed the 4 screws from the top, removed the "diaphram", flushed it through with water, put it back together, ran the station for 10 mins
and the noise has gone.

Thanks for your help and suggestions, it was driving me mad. What a simple fix, if this turns out to be it.
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby abwal » Wed Nov 02, 2016 5:02 pm

Well done! (Y)
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby gonetopilbara » Thu Nov 03, 2016 9:57 am

spoke too soon.

the problem is back, exactly the same, but now it happens with both stations.

If I didn't know better, I would say the noise is coming from the brass double adapter you can see in the video that
is connected to the main house tap.

any further thoughts?
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby abwal » Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:19 am

Did you try adjusting pressure on both the solenoids and the tap?

What sort of washer is in the tap? Nylon/plastic washers are notorious for vibrating. You can cure this by squashing the shank of the washer slightly with pliers/multigrips so that it is a tight fit in its housing.
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby gonetopilbara » Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:02 pm

Hi,

Tried adjusting flow at tap and master valve. The 13mm solenoids do not appear to have any way of adjusting flow.

This is the pope brand I am using.

Image

All the washers I can see are rubber.

I have taken the tap double adapter apart and shown photos below.

It appears to have some sort of valve in it which I don't know what it is for unless it is to prevent backflow.

Could this be the source of my problems even though if this same connection is used with a hose and spray trigger I don't get any noise from it.

Hope we can nut out what is going on as this is driving me nuts. :shock:

Image

Image
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby gonetopilbara » Fri Nov 04, 2016 3:01 pm

Ok - maybe this time it is fixed.

I have removed what appears to be a pressure valve from the tap double adapater.

It had 1400Kpa stamped on it so hopefully I have not caused any further issues.

Both stations now seem to run without any noise.

We will wait until Sunday when it runs on Auto to see if the problems has gone away.

Judging by the calcium around the tap I think I should probably run an inline filter. Do these normally go before or after the master isolation solenoid?

Assuming it needs to be accessible to be cleaned regularly?
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Re: Retic noise and leak

Postby abwal » Fri Nov 04, 2016 6:08 pm

Let's hope it is right this time.

This is one with a flow control. http://www.popeproducts.com.au/product/ ... -control-1

I had a different brand, but it also had a flow control. An older one had a screw that could be used to control flow.

The purpose of a filter is to keep solids out. Calcium is dissolved in the water so will pass straight through. I did not bother with one as our water was clear of solids. I suspect your supply will be clear, too. Filters are usually placed as the first thing after the water supply tap.
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